CLEVELAND, Ohio — Pitching plans are up in the air for the Guardians, who open a three-game series Monday in Chicago with Joey Cantillo on the mound and a couple of big question marks after that. Meanwhile, Cleveland’s offense has been remarkably absent over its last two games, at a time when Guardians hitters need to start getting sharp for the postseason. On Monday’s podcast, Paul Hoynes and Joe Noga look at what Cleveland could do with its rotation and how Stephen Vogt can get his offense out of its funk.
Listen and read along with an AI-generated transcript of the podcast below. More Guardians coverage Should the Browns help Deshaun Watson rein in his toughness? What to do with slumping Steven Kwan: Terry’s Talkin’ podcast Now is not the time for offense to run and hide: Guardians breakfast Guardians, Chicago White Sox series preview, pitching matchups Read the automated transcript of today’s podcast below. Because it’s a computer-generated transcript, it may contain errors and misspellings.
Joe Noga 0:06 Welcome back to the Cleveland Baseball Talk podcast. I’m Joe. Noga, joined by Paul Hoynes.
The late Monday edition of the Cleveland Baseball Talk Podcast, after trip back from the West Coast, Hornsey the Guardians lost through two straight to the Dodgers after winning the first game in that series. Both of the games on Saturday and Sunday were struggle offensively, Cleveland winds up going oh for 20 with runners in scoring position for the series. All of their their runs.
They scored against the Dodgers, came via the home run and they were shut out for the 15th time this season on Sunday against a familiar face in Jack Flaherty. Flaherty, of course, traded to the Dodgers at the deadline from Detroit after having faced Cleveland three times already this season. In a Tiger’s uniform, he comes back to haunt them again on Sunday with seven and a third shutout innings.
And the guardians just couldn’t seem to get things going against Flaherty once again. Paul Hoynes 1:16 Yeah, it was. It’s no contest against Flarity when he faces uh Cleveland Joe, he goes what 7 and a third innings? Fourth quarter four hits, six strike outs, just he dominates him.
He’s he’s really pitched well against them. Four different times this year and they just look like a a struggling offense. Joe, I’ve you know, it’s such a weird team.
I mean, you know what, they’ve been shut out 15 times. Uh, and now the only the only way they can score runs is is to hit the home run. And you know that they’re not a home run hitting team.
It’s just, you know, they’ve got to backwards right now. Joe Noga 1:58 Yeah. And at times there, this team really does or has shown, you know, signs of that youth and that inexperience and and just that that streaklines that you would associate with a team of young players at the beginning of the year when they had things rolling and they had their offense was rolling.
Uh, you know, it’s sort of covered up some of the the, you know, the ugly spots in, in, in the lineup and in the, you know, in the composition of the team. But over the course of 162 game season, everything gets exposed and I think that might be the case. Here is things are catching up to them at some point and and really it just.
It’s not like they’re out there making mistakes or playing bad baseball. It’s just that every team goes through these cycles and these, these, these slumps and and right now is is not the ideal time for this offense to be running away and hiding it. It’s 19 games left in the season and you’ve gotta start to, you know, to, to play your best baseball.
Not, you know, sort of cost on on what you’ve done throughout the season? Paul Hoynes 3:13 I’ve no doubt about it. And you know, when you when you know Kwan is, he was benched yesterday to give him a day off because he’s, you know, he just hasn’t hit the since the All-Star break and he’s really in a skid right now. So that you’ve got to start Brennan and left field.
You know, you just go down that lineup and you know Ramirez is struggling. You know, himenez is swinging the bat. Well, that’s good to see.
Thomas is swinging the bat OK, but you know she Schneemann Freeman. Phone Naylor. I mean, you know that that’s no contest right there.
Those guys, those guys are not doing anything and and and when you’re one of your main guys like, Ramirez and Kwan are not, you know, not contributing. Those guys get exposed and this lineup, I mean, Joe, does this lineup scare you? Joe Noga 4:04 I don’t think this this lineup would scare any of the contending teams. Uh.
Especially when they go up against the the frontline pitching from some of these teams, it’s what we’re seeing. What we saw against, you know, Flaherty, it’s just, it’s such a struggle for them to get going when they get a guy on the mound that they’re facing who you know can execute his game plan, like Steven Boats said after the game, Flaherty was hitting the bottom of the zone with his fastball and it opened up a lot of things that that he could do with his, his breaking pitches and. And that was a formula and a plan that that worked for him the the previous three times they faced him, you know.
Which begs the question if that worked and you knew what that was working the first three times you faced him, you know, why wouldn’t you go after him down in the zone there? In in the fourth game, if he’s just that much better at executing than you are at executing your game plan at the plate, then you know things are gonna go the way they did and and that’s what happened. Tanner Bibee on the other side was not bad. He gave up, you know, he got out of a bases loaded situation and giving up one run in the fourth inning and then he gives up a home run to show.
Hey, otani. But who hasn’t given up at home run to show Otani this year? Ohtani hit one off the facing of the upper deck and and right field that wrapped it around the the right field pole. I kind of had the feeling that coming into this series, Ohtani’s quest for 5050 season, was going to be aided by the Guardians in in one way or another, and and they certainly did.
They gave it they, you know, they gave up two home runs to him. He was at 46 and 46 by the time Cleveland left town, but he did get on base with a a single earlier in the game and and everybody sort of had it in mind always. He’s gone.
He’s gonna steal a base and and bibee picked him off to his credit, you know, ended an inning by by picking him off at first base without even a challenge from Dave Roberts. So you know, they did a decent job against Shohei Otani in the series. Mookie Betts, I think, had you know, three or four hits in the series, and all of them went for extra bases.
Max Muncie had a home run against them. So you know the the the big bats in LA’s order and you know they, they kind of spread them around, but they they weren’t the the only reason that that LA was so effective in the final two games of the series. You know, columns pitching sort of did the job there with the exception of Gavin Williams.
Start on a Saturday night. Paul Hoynes 6:46 Yeah, I agree, Joe. A Boyd was great Friday night.
You know, 6 innings, one run, six strikeouts. Just just really efficient. He you know, every time he goes out there, he looks like the same guy.
Really pitched really. Navigated around that that dangerous Los Angeles lineup. Gavin Williams, you know, just really concerned concerning Joe.
I mean, he’s coming off his best start of the season, you know when he goes 7 innings against Kansas City, you were there. I mean, that’s as good as we’ve seen him all season. Joe Noga 7:19 Mm-hmm.
Paul Hoynes 7:22 And then he goes against the the Dodgers. It doesn’t get out of the first inning, gives up five runs and two and 2/3. Then you, you know, kind of lay that bullpen open for a bullpen game and you know you’re you.
You’re, you know, the team has been scrambling ever since, and the whole, the whole, the whole rotation, Joe, to me is is really kind of in a state of flux. You know, take us through what Steven bought. Told you guys yesterday.
Joe Noga 7:47 Yep. So postgame after Steven votes uh, you know, comments to the media, he was heading back towards the clubhouse and he turned around and he he said, Oh yeah. Joe, Joey Cantillo tomorrow.
And Blake, I’m sorry. She’s Ben Lively had been listed as the starting pitcher for Monday against Chicago. And you know that we were all kind of confused.
So we asked if Lively wasn’t going on Monday. Then you know what’s the rest of the rotation look like because it was, it was TBA on Tuesday and we all assumed it was Alex Cobb. You know, they were waiting on his finger there.
But you know, the the Guardian said. Uh, we cantillo on Monday, TBA on Tuesday and TBA on Wednesday when Matt Boyd was scheduled to to be in the rotation. So a lot right now I think depends on Alex Cobb Blister on his finger.
How that’s progressing, whether they want to give him an extra 2 days or one day to wait, and I think they might be trying to give Ben Lively an extra day or two and push him back. Uh, just to to rest him, because the fatigue factor is real. It you know, he’s he’s thrown 135 innings by far the the most of his career.
I think by forty of the most, the most in his career. So you know that there’s there’s a lot at play here. Uh, including how? How well Cobb can come back or how? How sure they are that his his blisters healed up and how effective he’ll be.
Paul Hoynes 9:30 Yeah. I I just you know, this is not the time to be a playing musical chairs with your, with your rotation. It’s like they’re it’s like they have they’re they’re they act like they have a 10 game lead.
They’re the lead is down to 2 1/2 games, so I know they’re the safety net of the wild card is really reassuring to them, but it’d be nice to get this rotation in order and and everybody pulling on the same end of the rope at the same time. Joe Noga 9:42 Umm. Paul Hoynes 9:59 You know it you you can feel you know how this rotation could look.
We’ve only seen it maybe one or two times since the acquisition of Boyd in Cobb. You know where where they both been in the line. The rotation at the same time and you know the last time through, you know Coppit Cobb pitched well against Pittsburgh, you know.
Uh. Yeah, and aborted. Pitch well before that.
Then you see Gavin Williams. Have a good start. You know, you really, you know, Bibee has been solid and you know, you really feel confident.
But right now, you know, I they just kind of pull Cantillo out of the hat. Where where did Cantillo? How did he get in? In involved in this. Joe Noga 10:40 Yeah, it it was.
It was kind of surprising to hear that. Uh, that was the the name there. And it also, you know it also means somebody elses is gonna get.
You talk about a rotation influx, the the entire pitching staff is in flux. A big surprise Sunday morning after Gavin Williams goes short on Saturday, you kind of had a feeling that maybe somebody was. It was gonna get a ticket to well Ohh AAA.
You weren’t expecting it. You weren’t expecting it to be Scott Barlow getting designated for assignment? A guy who had you know logged 63 innings and and been a major part of the bullpen success earlier in the season. It struggled throughout August and really hadn’t been the same pitcher for for a little over a month now.
I gave up a home run on Saturday evening and then that turned out to be his his last appearance with the Guardians vote said after the move was made on Sunday that the club was devastated to have to make that move, to have to go in that direction. But for the fourth time this year, they added Anthony Ghost to the lineup to the roster, and I wouldn’t be surprised if here in a few hours that Anthony goes is the guy that they designate for assignment once again in order to get Cantillo on the roster. Paul Hoynes 12:03 Yeah, I you know, I I think that’s a that’s a, you know, good observation I mean and and his ghost better than a Barlow.
I don’t know. You know that’s a God. You know, this could be such a cruel game.
I mean, this is a guy that’s been in, in your road to, in your bullpen, you know, since day one, he’s giving you 66. What, like 63 games? You know, it’s strike out, you know, to innings pitched 68 to 55 innings, pitch is still good, you know? Yes, he’s struggled and I don’t know. Do you think maybe he got cooked a little bit by the way they used him? Is is that the first sign of a of? Joe Noga 12:40 Alright.
Paul Hoynes 12:42 You know, the way this bullpen is head has, you know, voters head to use this bullpen. Joe Noga 12:47 Yeah. And and you could tell over the last couple of weeks, I think they’ve they’ve protected the the key guys at the back of the, the, the bullpen have only come out in situations where you know there’s a there’s a close lead or you know there’s leverage.
So Kate Smith, the 100, Gaddis, obviously Emmanuel Clase. Those are all those guys. They’ve done a little bit more to protect them lately.
You’ve seen Eli Morgan pitch a little bit more Nick Sandlin being coming out of the the gate early, and Pedro Avila, I think we can call him the Venezuelan, Brian Shaw. Right now, it seems like he’s pitching literally every other day. So, uh, I I I guess there.
Paul Hoynes 13:29 Yeah. Joe Noga 13:33 There, you’ve gotta have an eye on the postseason and and and October if you’re, you know, setting things up right now. But you gotta get there first man and Anthony goes isn’t going to be, you know, winning games for you out there.
I mean, he comes out yesterday and gives up the home run to Muncie and another run there in the 8th inning. Just in in a game that was too nothing. Uh, so yeah, I would expect those to be the move this afternoon.
Don’t know when that could come down for sure, but yeah, I I just Barlow hadn’t been highly effective, but you could. You could sort of hide that if you if you wanted to pitch him in non leverage situations I guess would be one way, but they decided to part ways with them. You know, this is a guy they they traded Angel della Santos for.
Uh, and what was really just a salary dump by San Diego at the time because San Diego wanted to get under the luxury tax. The $7 million contract for Barlow this year. Uh, it was pretty much a wash as you dealt away, Cal Quantrill.
But, but how much better would Cal Quantrill look at Guardians uniform right now if they had all that to do over again? Paul Hoynes 14:52 Yeah, that’s a, you know, it’s a, I mean you look in the rearview mirror on that one and and you’ve got to wonder, I mean, you know, I think the only reason they were able to sign Barlow is because they traded the they traded call control and, you know, didn’t pay him. What? Whatever he made an arbitration 6.56 point 6,000,000 that the Rockies gave them.
So you know it, you know that. That’s why it’s surprised me. And you know, maybe maybe they’re clearing a spot in, in the, you know, down the stretch here for a guy like Walters or or somebody, one of those young relievers, Joe.
Joe Noga 15:26 Mm-hmm. Yeah, I think that’s the next move. Once they get beyond the OR even while they’re out there in, in, in Chicago, I think by the time uh Cleveland gets back back home to Progressive Field to face the the raise, you’ll probably see Andrew Walters up from AAA to take what was Barlow’s spot in the bullpen.
That will be going to Cantillo for this spot. Start here on Monday, Monday night against the White Sox against against the White Sox and Grady Sizemore. You talked to Grady Sizemore last week about taking over as the interim manager for the for Chicago.
Uh, it’s seems like he’s been assigned the job of bailing out a sinking ship with a teaspoon. What? Uh, what did you get out of Grady Sizemore last week when you talked to a one of the legends of, you know, Cleveland’s last 30 years of baseball? Sizemore, just a guy who you know a lot of a lot of people grew up watching and and and idolizing the way he played center field for for Cleveland. Paul Hoynes 16:42 Yeah, joy, talk to him for you know, about 10-15 minutes to team.
The White Sox were Fenway Park, and he’s excited about the job he he says he’s kind of almost become addicted to managing, and it’s such a strange twist for for Grady, because when he retired, he said he never even gave coaching a thought, much less managing a thought. But you know, his kids are a little older now. All another former Indian.
Uh, you know, went to Chicago as assistant GM. He had hired him a previously as a, you know, as a spring training instructor and and an interim interim an intern 50 for $15.00 an hour to work with the the the Diamondbacks.
You know, complex team. Last year in Arizona and he kind of got the fever again and, you know, he says he’s enjoying it. He says it’s it’s a tough year.
Obviously what they lost 111 games, they’re on pace to lose the most games in the modern era. Umm. But he says he’s trying to keep a positive attitude.
He likes the the, you know, the challenge of the job. Joe Noga 17:58 Did you ask him about his first ejection as a manager that you know, went down the other night when he he came out and basically was sticking it up for a for his guys because he thought the the strike zone wasn’t wasn’t exactly fair at the time with under Windows step? Paul Hoynes 18:13 Yeah. Yeah.
You asked him about it and he, he said. You know, I he’s he’s never. He had never been injected from any game as a player, and this was the first injection for him and he was talking to Josh Josh Barfield after the game and Barfield asked him, you know, what did you say to a hunter? What did you say to the umpire? Great, he said.
I can’t remember. I blacked out. Joe Noga 18:39 And well, I, John boy on on Twitter, broke down the video and he did the the lip reading and I won’t repeat the the language that greater used, but Tom Brady is fond of the the phrase LFG and I think that was repeated a lot in the exchange between Sizemore and and Hunter Wendelstedt.
Paul Hoynes 18:40 So that was funny. Joe Noga 19:03 So just it’ll be fun to watch these, you know, Sizemore and. And and Cleveland on the field at the same time tonight.
So lots of lots to look forward to there as we get closer to game time today. Did wanna mention Hoynsie before we. We continue guarding subtext.
Uh. Really good. Uh, we had a good weekend out there in in Los Angeles, breaking a couple of news items.
So people were aware of some of the moves, including the Scott Barlow move before that got out on social media. Uh, it was to our our subtextures first. If you wanna get inside information like that from hoynsie and from me on road trips, the best way to subtext sign up by going to cleveland.
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Just found out that Steven Kwan has been named the Guardians nominee for the Roberto Clemente Award. Bob tremendous honor for Steven Kwan. Uh, in his third season now? Uh, and and really emerged as one of the leaders, not just of the team on the field.
But you know, in the clubhouse and and a guy who’s, uh, his his character is is matched only by his abilities on the field and and he is, you know, just a joy to watch play the game. Roberto Clemente Award, the highest honor that any any you know, player in the league can aspire to sort of off the field. It means you know you’re you’re you’re more than just a baseball player, and you’re more than just a, you know, somebody who’s going out there, earning a paycheck.
You’re doing something that makes a difference in the community, and that’s that’s Steven Kwan to a tee. Paul Hoynes 21:06 Yeah, Joe, it’s it is, like you said, it’s a big honor, you know, it’s the most, I think, the biggest honor off the field. Honor that a player can earn in the past.
What Carlos Carrasco is wanted. Jim, Tommy is one of the Andre Thornton has wanted. You know, those are the.
Those are the kind of people that win the Roberto Clemente Award. It’s presented during the World Series. You know each team you know nominates a player, and you know the the voting takes place and you know that the eventual winner is named at the at the World Series.
It’s really a cool award. Joe Noga 21:42 Yeah, and it it honors. You know Roberto Clemente and I, I think in in a in a sport, in a game where, you know numbers are, you know, Jersey numbers are significant.
You know 42, you 19 in Cleveland, very significant number for Bob Feller, 42 for Jackie Robinson. Of course, the number 21, for Berto Clemente, everybody knows that everybody’s aware of that. That’s a huge, you know, just sort of symbol for players, particularly the the Puerto Rican players, but uh, as far as you know, what it would mean for Kwan to win that award? Uh, I’m sure he would tell you it.
It would be the the highest honor that that he could possibly imagine. Not besides winning, you know the the working of the year of the MVP, both of which you know, he was a contender for in in 2021 and you know, maybe not the MVP, but you know maybe someday for for for quantity uh hoynsie as we get ready for this series opener tonight this is not a not a serious to be sort of overlooked or taken lightly the guardians have not played well against the White Sox so far this year they need to win the season series they need to win this series ideally they would they would. Need to sweep while the Royals are out there facing the Yankees and a BIG4 game series.
Just, you know, one of the Guardians have to do to be effective out there on the South side the night. Paul Hoynes 23:19 They need to score some runs. Joe.
Uh, you’re right. Uh, they have not played well against this team. You know, obviously most of the the the players that that hurt the guardians on on Chicago’s team have been traded.
You know, most of those guys are gone, but there’s still a, you know, Andrew Vaughn is still here. Joe Noga 23:31 Mm-hmm. Paul Hoynes 23:37 You know, Louise Robert Junior still here.
Those guys have done damage against Cleveland. The White Sox are five and five against Cleveland. They’ve won eight, only won eight games in the AL Central Joe this season.
Five of them have come against Cleveland. So you know, if the Guardians don’t have their radar up right now coming into this series, if they think this is gonna be a walkover. Shame on them.
You know, they’ve gotta make some hay right here. Joe Noga 24:03 Yeah. Yeah, we we have before we started recording, we went back and looked 15 shutouts for the Guardians this year.
That’s more shutouts than the more times been shut out than the White Sox, who have lost 111 games the White Sox have only been shut out 13 times. It’s more shutouts than the Guardians suffered in 2021 when they were no hit three times in the season. So yeah, this offense needs to get its act together and do it quickly.
Uh, because this week, for the next, you know, seven days games against the White Sox and Rays. All games that need to be need to be won and need to sort of build that momentum as they head down the stretch. All right.
Hoynes. That’s gonna wrap it up for today’s podcast. We’ll check in with the recap of tonight’s game when we talk to you tomorrow.
Paul Hoynes 25:00 All right, Joe. Got a question you want answered on the podcast? Register for Guardians Subtext to hear your Cleveland Baseball questions answered exclusively on the show. Send a text to 216-208-4346 to subscribe for $3.
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